Teorije (crackpot and otherwise)

[Wikiceha]

UrchinStar47 kaže:

Ne nužno, i tako nije sigurno hoće li Danny uopće doći do Westerosa tokom iduće knjige, a ako i dođe, doći će pred kraj, što ostavlja dovoljno vremena "netjaku" da obavi svoje. Nemoj zaboravit da Danny ima posla prije nego što ode, ima Dothrakije za preuzet, rat sa robovlasnicima za dobit, grad-dva za spalit na Essosu (Volantis i možda Pentos, IIRC), i sl.
Uostalom, računaj na to da se Martin samo nada da će sve završit u iduće dvije knjige.

Iskreno, meni se čini da je Martin sa zaljevom dobrim djelom već završio, Barristan je u onim objavljenim poglavljima riješio opsadu, sad "samo" treba srediti stvari s novopridošlim željeznima.
Priča s Dothrakijima ne bi trebala predugo trajati.
Proljefka bi vjerojatno pred kraj te sljedeće knjige trebala doći do 7k (ili će opet zapeti u Slobodnim gradovima).
Preuzimanje Volantisa mi zvuči realno, a i neka priča s Pentosom će sigurno biti.
Mislim, može se i dogoditi da se mali netjak namuči, riješi to sve, pa da ga onda pojede tetkin zmaj.
Jbg.
To bi i bilo nekako u Martinovom žaru
No ja bi ipak da ovoj nije sve servirano, već da i neke stvari mora riješiti (po mogućnosti da najebe) sama.
Sukob nje i Cersei bi bio interesantan.

S obzirom da će Stannis vjerojatno preuzeti Sjever, bit će zanimljive spekulacije LFa, od zbivanja u Porječju nakon povlačenja Lanisterske vojske i ponovnim rastom Blackfisha, a i "Bijelom svadbom", pokoljem Freyevih u režiji LHS).
Nekako mi se čini teškom pričom da se mala Sansa zaruči za Prijestolonasljednika, a da se on onda proglasi vazalom Snowa koji je došao na vlast ili Sjevernjačkom urotom (oporuka Robba) ili oporukom Stannisa...
Pa da LF dođe u probleme manipuliranja s njim.
Valjda bumo vidli
Agincourt je po meni siguran (kao i bitka/kampanja na sjeveru gdje bi Stannis trebao razbiti Boltone).
Da Martin samo čita teorije fanova, već bi mu sve knjige bile gotove.

Dakle, na kraju 6. knjige bi trebao imati Proljefku blizu Dragonstonea, prostarkovsku koaliciju na vlasti u 3 sjeverne pokrajine (vrijeme Vukova se trebala knjiga znat), klanje u Grudobranu i kaos na jugu.

Valjda bi trebao i Zid pasti, a i Euron bi trebao pokazati neke adute.
I onda je u zadnjoj knjizi teže s*anje i krv do koljena

[UrchinStar47]

Blood of the Conqueror - esej o Barristanu: https://warsandpoliticsoficeandfire....the-turncloak/

[Wikiceha]

Je li Robb Brandonovo kopile?

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2007...1579911953730/
Treba se logirati, a tekst ima 25 tisuća linija.

Budem ga razlomio u par postova.

Također, tema zašto se svi Rhaegarovi sinovi zovu Aegon
https://www.forum.hr/showthread.php?t=1027139

[Wikiceha]

Something peculiar is going on with Catelyn Stark and her thoughts and feelings surrounding Robb, Ned, and Brandon Stark.

Catelyn is a Stark, and though she has come to embody more of the North throughout her years in Winterfell, don't be fooled, because she is still a Tully, and the Tully values are far different than the Stark's.

As a young girl in Riverrun, and eldest daughter to one of the most powerful houses in Westeros Catelyn Tully is raised to follow to a strict set of values and morals.

Family, Duty, Honor and in that order:
family comes first, honor comes last.

At twelve her father had arranged to have Catelyn wed the future Lord of Winterfell, Brandon Stark.
When introduced to Brandon, Catelyn Tully is pleased and thanks her father for making a splendid match for her. She is now living the dream, engaged to the tall and handsome Brandon stark, heir to one of the oldest and most prominent houses in Westeros.
Until the dream ends and just before they were to wed he dies and she marries Brandon’s younger brother Ned, a stranger she doesn't even know.

But is there something more to the story?
Brandon was known as a man who loved blood on his sword:

ADWD 41: (lady Dustin to Theon)
“Brandon was never shy about taking what he wanted...
I still remember the look of my maiden’s blood on his cock the night he claimed me. I think Brandon liked the sight as well. A bloody sword is a beautiful thing."

This shows unlike Ned, Brandon was not all about honor, he had no problem taking a woman's virginity out of wedlock
This is a seemingly useless little tidbit of information,
so why did GRRM bother to tell it in the first place?

Catelyn was in love with Brandon, and if she believes she is to wed this man very shortly, would there really be much harm in laying with him?
Even if she does get pregnant, it will be Brandon’s child, so what harm could come of it?
Keep in mind that these were times of peace, so expecting Catelyn to be careful because Brandon might die in a war is out of the question.

Catelyn has three distinct thoughts in a row when she learns of Robb marrying Jeyne followed by an interesting realization and although unwilling, acceptance.
1. “No, that cannot be, you are only a child.”
This is a mother not yet willing to give up her son. (family)
2.“And besides, you have pledged another.
This was his duty”
3.“Mother have mercy, Robb, what have you done?”
He failed to Honor the marriage pact

Then finally:
Only then came her belated remembrance.
Follies done for love?
He has bagged me neat as a hare in a snare.
I seem to have already forgiven him."

Brandon knew how to take what he wanted. Seems like he begged some,
(We will wed on my return he vowed) and she agreed,
hence the follies done for love.

When Brandon died shortly before they were to wed,
Catelyn now having realized she is pregnant does not want her baby to grow up a bastard,
so when told she must marry Ned in a haste, she does so gladly, planning to tell him that the child is his own.

We know that Lord Hoster Tully, Catelyn's father,
had arranged for her to marry Ned in a haste.
She didn't know if Ned would agree to marry her,
and it may be that Ned knew of what had happened between Catelyn & Brandon and he took on that responsibility for the sake of his brother, his nephew, and to get the Riverland's support.
Keep that in mind when we get to Littlefinger's letter.

That also connects to one of your theories MP,
(Robert) “Gods have mercy, you scarcely knew Catelyn.”
-“I had taken her to wife. She was carrying my child.”
To me this seems like a case of someone who mentions what he's done, and then explains why he's done it.

In any case, Whether Ned knew about Cat's pregnancy or not is not crucial to this theory because Catelyn would have lied and deceived whoever she needs to in order to keep her son from being born a bastard.

Remember the Tully Words:
-Family (the child she carries)
-Duty (a marriage alliance)
-Honor (tell no one, ever, of Robbs true father).

Another issue is the way that Catelyn treats Jon.
Jealousy is understandable,
but it's very uncommon for a woman and a mother, with maternal instincts, to treat a small child so badly.

In the show Catelyn says:
“All this horror that's come to our family,
It's all because I couldn't love a motherless child".

And, she was never jealous.
She didn't even care Ned cheated,
she only ever cared about Jon being raised at Winterfell.

Keep in mind that the only way a bastard can threaten a trueborn 1st son is if the trueborn son is actually a bastard.
This is the very same thing that makes Eddard suspicious in king's landing, why would a bastard trouble Cersei if her children are trueborn? Even if the bastard is older than her children?

When Catelyn discovers Cersei's children are bastards who are not Robert's, she thinks:

"Would even Cersei be so mad? Catelyn was speechless."

Why EVEN Cersei? Why not simply say Cersei?
She can't believe another woman did the same thing she did, which is to let her husband raise another man's child, as his own.

Age: Brandon died in 282AL , Rob was born in 283AL. Time wise, it's plausible.

This is what Catelyn thinks about Robb:
“Let him grow taller, she asked the gods. Let him know sixteen, and twenty, and fifty. Let him grow as tall as his father, and hold his own son in his arms. ”

So lets ask ourselves Why these numbers?
Does Catelyn just pick them out at random or is there meaning behind them?
They certainly don’t seem to apply to Ned and yet they fit perfectly when applied to Brandon Stark

-Brandon was 16 when he met Catelyn and they fell in “love”
-And was 20 when he died.
-Although Rickard Starks exact age is unknown,
I believe this is who Catelyn is thinking of when she says 50, Robbs Grandfather who died with Brandon.

So here we have Catelyn's thinking of Robb's life:
may he live to meet a girl and fall in love,
may he not die at 20 like his father
or die at 50 like his grandfather.

may he hold his own son in his arms, something Brandon was never able to do.

Also, if Robb dies at 16 these numbers now signify the deaths of 3 generations of Starks:
Robb-at 16, Brandon-at 20, and Rickard-at 50.

Catelyn thinking about Robb:

“Brandon Stark had bid her wait as well.
“I shall not be long, my lady,” he had vowed.
“We will be wed on my return.”

"Yet when the day came at last, it was his brother Eddard who stood beside her in the sept. Ned had lingered scarcely a fortnight with his new bride before he too had ridden off to war with promises on his lips. At least he had left her with more than words;
he had given her a son.
Nine moons had waxed and waned, and Robb had been born in Riverrun while his father still warred in the south.

Nine moons since when? This paragraph started with Brandon, not with Ned.

"She had brought him forth in blood and pain, not knowing whether Ned would ever see him. Her son.”

so Why say HER son?

This is how the sentence should have been like,
Given the premise that Ned is Robb's father:
"not knowing whether Ned would ever see him. His son.”
Or:
"not knowing whether Ned would ever see him. Their son.”

“ he had given her a son.” He did give her a son, instead of a bastard.

By marrying Catelyn,
Ned has effectively turned her Bastard into a son.
A bastard which by the laws of Westeros is granted essentially nothing, as they are only a “Shadow” of a man, who now becomes a legitimatized son, and heir to Winterfell.
Ned “gives” Cat a son by marrying her.

“they had spent that year apart, Ned off at war in the south”
This way, because she gave birth at Riverrun without Ned,
Ned would not know exactly how long after he left Robb was born.

“On Catelyn’s own wedding night ...
When Lord Dustin had beheld her naked, he’d told Ned that
her breasts were enough to make him wish he’d never been weaned”

Breasts are the very first to expose a pregnancy, way before the belly shows.
Why would GRRM make the effort to give us this little tidbit of information about how her breasts reminded men of nursing?

Robert's Rebellion timeline is speculative, at best.
This is how I think it went, in chronological order:

1. Catelyn and Brandon Conceived Robb at Riverrun.
2.Brandon left for KL, and died.
3.Ned married Catelyn BEFORE calling his banners, to make sure he has the Riverland's support.
Riding all the way North from the Vale, only to go all the way back in times of war seems unlikely. Ned probably sent someone in his name to call his banners, while he went to wed Catelyn.
This would place their marriage likely far less than 3 months after Brandon left Riverrun, probably around 6-8 weeks after Robb's conecption.
4.Ned goes to war.
5.Jon is born.
6.Robb is born.

[Wikiceha]

A quote from Catelyn:
"when Lord Hoster promised her to Brandon Stark,
she had thanked him for making her such a splendid match.

I gave Brandon my favor to wear ,

And when Brandon was murdered and Father told me I must wed his brother, I did so gladly, though I never saw Ned’s face until our wedding day."

Her fiance she was inlove with just died,
so why in the world is she all giddy about marrying a stranger she doesn't even know?

"I gave my maidenhood to this solemn stranger

and sent him off to his war... and the woman who bore him his bastard, because I always did my duty.”

Family first; taking care of her son so he won't grow up a bastard
Then Duty: marrying for an alliance
Then honor: No reason the stranger should know, lets not taint everybody's honor.

“Her father promised her to Brandon Stark, and so it was to him that
she gave her token, a pale blue handscarf she had embroidered with the leaping trout of Riverrun.

“I gave Brandon my favor to wear “
“it was to him that she gave her token”
Seems like there's a pattern here.
Could the token/favor be her virginity?

This is Catelyn in her own thought saying that Littlefingers story is a lie, although he claims she gave him her maidenhead, this is her showing that in fact she gave it to Brandon, these things reek of metaphor. Favor to wear=Blood on his cock, Token= her virginity.

Many clues come from Robb's Appearance:

“She remembered her own childish disappointment, the first time she had laid eyes on Eddard Stark.
She had pictured him as a younger version of his brother Brandon, but that was wrong. Ned was shorter and plainer of face, and so somber”

Note that she is disappointed with Ned, comparing his looks to Brandon’s.

Her thoughts of Robb:
“ Catelyn watched a breeze stir his auburn hair, so like her own, and wondered when her son had grown so big.
Fifteen , and near as tall as she was. ... Let him grow as tall as his father"

Catelyn specifically noted how disappointed she was with Ned's height, compared to Brandon who was tall.
So how DID Robb get so tall if Ned is short?
And if Ned is so short, who does she mean when wanting Robb to grow, as tall as him?
Again this sounds like Brandon to us.

“Her own children had more Tully about them than Stark.
Arya was the only one to show much of Ned in her features.
And Jon Snow, but he was never mine.”

Cat about Robb:
“he had the Tully coloring, the auburn hair, the blue eyes.
Yet now for the first time she saw something of Eddard Stark in his face, something as stern and hard as the north.”

Seriously, it should NOT take you 15 years to see some kind of resemblance between your son and his father. And notice that she only speaks about his demeanor, not about his looks.

A quote from Arya:
"‘The wolf blood,’ my father used to call it.
Lyanna had a touch of it, and my brother Brandon more than a touch. It brought them both to an early grave.”

Robb has a temper, just like Brandon, and both of them died young because of it.

“(robb) Enough.” For just an instant Robb sounded more like Brandon than his father."
-This is catelyn's worst fear, that people would see how just much Robb resembles Brandon. Hold that thought because we will go into why Robb's looks matters.

Cat about Brandon:
“He was on his way to Riverrun when …”
Strange, how telling it still made her throat grow tight, after all these years. “… when he heard about Lyanna, and went to King’s Landing instead.
It was a rash thing to do.” ...
Her own father had raged when the news had been brought to Riverrun.
The gallant fool, he called Brandon."

I believe the beginning of this quote solves any timeline problems between Robbs conception and the wedding. If memory serves it is mentioned that Brandon was on his way to meet his father coming down from Winterfell for the wedding. So IMO Brandon makes his vow to Cat, seduces and impregnates her, goes and meets his father where he then rushes to Kings Landing.

Cat about Jon:
“nothing Catelyn said would persuade him to send the boy away.
It was the one thing she could never forgive him.
She had come to love her husband with all her heart,
but she had never found it in her to love Jon.
She might have overlooked a dozen bastards for Ned’s sake,
as long as they were out of sight.

Jon was never out of sight, and as he grew,
he looked more like Ned than any of the trueborn sons she bore him.
Somehow that made it worse.
“Jon must go,” she said now.”

Why did it matter that Jon looked more like Ned than any of her sons?
Why did it matter that Robb didn't look like Ned at all?

This is a quote from Catelyn speaking to Maester Vyman about
Stannis and King Robert's bastard, Edric storm:

-“Perhaps he fears the boy’s claim.”
“A bastard’s claim? No, it’s something else …
what does this child look like?”
(M. Vyman describes Edric) Visitors oft thought him Lord Renly’s own son.”
-“And Renly favored Robert.”

Catelyn had a glimmer of understanding.
“Stannis means to parade his brother’s bastard before the realm,
so men might see Robert in his face and wonder why there is no such likeness in Joffrey.”
(No he didn't but that's her 'glimmer of understanding', that's where her thoughts go)

-(M. Vyman)“Would that mean so much?”
-“Those who favor Stannis will call it proof.”

[Wikiceha]

This conversation is about how Edric looks more like King Robert than Robert's own children, and how it could be used as proof that Robert has no children with Cersei. Cersie's children take after their "uncle Jaime".

On the other hand, we have Jon, who looks more like Ned than Robb, who takes after his "uncle Brandon".

Remember, no bastard could threaten the claim of a trueborn son, even if the bastard is older, he does not pose a threat.

Catelyns glimmer of understanding about Stannis parading Edric around is directly comparable to her thoughts on Jon and how Ned called him son for all the north to see.

Catelyn's thought process + motivations:

This is where a lot of the clues come from.
Catelyn uses very particular words that do not seem to fit, given the premise that Ned is Robb's father.

Ned to Catelyn:
-“I never asked for this cup to pass to me.”
-“Perhaps not,” Catelyn said,
“but Brandon is dead, and the cup has passed,
and you must drink from it, like it or not.”

Family before honor. Ned took Brandon's responsibility so she couldn't care less whether he liked it or not.
She would do whatever it takes for her son to not grow up a bastard, but the heir to Winterfell he was supposed to be.

A quote from Catelyn:
“… Eddard Stark had married her in Brandon’s place, as custom decreed,
but the shadow of his dead brother still lay between them,
as did the other,
the shadow of the woman he would not name,
the woman who had borne him his bastard son.”

What is the shadow of the woman who had borne him his bastard son? That would be Jon.
&What is the shadow of Brandon? Robb.
This sentence ends with a code to the riddle:
“the woman who had borne him his bastard son.”
Shadow = bastard son, just like Melissandre's shadow babies.

Lets replace the words and read it again:

“the bastard son of his dead brother still lay between them, as did the other, the bastard son of the woman he would not name.”
-does it make more sense now?

This is what Catelyn thinks, after thinking about Edmure & Robb's safety:

“the tale of what she had seen and felt in Renly’s pavilion,, and what she must do to lay to rest the shadows that stalked her dreams...now there is only me, and it seems I know nothing, not even my duty. How can I do my duty if I do not know where it lies?”

A beautiful irony is Catelyn literally witnessing a shadow kill a king, this making her worst nightmares come true….This is Jon taking/killing Robbs claim.

Cat, thinking about Robb:
“Her thoughts were more of Robb, the infant at her breast, than of the husband she scarcely knew.”
(family before duty)
“He was welcome to whatever solace he might find between battles. “
(she welcome his cheating)
“And if his seed quickened, she expected he would see to the child’s needs.”

Now, it could simply mean she thinks that if Ned cheats during the war,
he would take care of the bastard,
but then, why not just say “if he fathered a child/bastard?”

If his seed quickens =is proof Ned's fertile,
because if after she has Robb she can't get pregnant with Ned, people would suspect Ned's infertile and that Robb isn't his.
But, if he already has a bastard, that means he's fertile.
and she's safe.

This also goes to show Catelyn WAS unsure Ned's fertility, Even though she’s pregnant with Robb.

This is what Catelyn thinks about Jon, when she discovers he will join the night's watch, something that makes very happy:
“And in time the boy would take the oath as well.
He would father no sons who might someday contest with Catelyn’s own grandchildren for Winterfell.”

This is the reason Catelyn is intimidated by Jon. He has a claim to Winterfell, being older than Robb and, at least to her knowledge, Ned's son, unlike Robb.

Cat about Rob:
“He looks like a Tully, she thought,
yet he’s still his father’s son,
and Ned taught him well.”

She just called Robb his father's son, why does she feel the need to mention Ned's name right after that?

There are 3 people in this sentence:
1.-he looke like a Tully-Catelyn
2.-he's still his father's son – Brandon
3.-And Ned taught him well- that's the man who raised him

This is how the sentence should have been phrased, had Ned been Robb's father:
“he's still his father's son, and HE taught him well.”
Or, “he's still his father's son, HE taught him well.” (No And, and no Ned, just a HE)

A conversation between Jaime and Catelyn, at Riverrun:

“No doubt Ned wished to spare you. His sweet young bride,
if not quite a maiden.”

Jaime's referring to Littlefinger telling everyone he took Cat's maidenhead:
(a quote from Tyrion)
“Why, every man at court has heard him tell how he took your maidenhead, my lady.”
“That is a lie!” Catelyn Stark said.”

Look at how much she objects to this accusation,
but when Jaime phrases it differently, without specifying who took her virginity, she doesn't object at all.

maidenhead = virginity
maidenhood = being an unwed female

Catelyn thinking about Ned:
“(she) sensed a coolness that was all at odds with Brandon, whose mirths had been as wild as his rages.

Even when he took her maidenhood,
their love had more of duty to it than of passion.
We made Robb that night, though;
we made a king together"

he took her maidenhood- note that she says maidenhood, not maidenhead. That only means she was now a married woman.

“ We made Robb that night”,“we made a king together” :
Made indeed. Catelyn is an unreliable narrator, just like Sansa, the unkissed.

Like I noted earlier, by Catelyn saying we made Robb that night, isn’t saying we conceived him through sex, but actually “made” him by their union.

When Robb can't understand why Jeyne doesn't get pregnant,
despite their efforts.
Catelyn says:
“It does not always happen the first time.”
But then she thinks to herself: “Though it did with you.”

Keep that in mind and listen to this this:

“Ned had lingered scarcely a fortnight with his new bride”

So they were newlyweds in Riverrun for two whole weeks,
but somehow she knows, for certain,
that she got pregnant on the first time they slept together.

So how exactly does she know it was on the first time?
Did she marry him and sleep with him only once during the whole two weeks?
Because soldiers, especially before, during and after wars, want to get busy.
So did she just fake a lot of migraines,
Or was Robb conceived on the very first, and only time, Catelyn had slept with Brandon?

These are Catelyn's thoughts:
"No one knew but her and Maester Vyman, and she had meant to keep it that way until … Until what?
Foolish woman, will holding it secret in your heart make it any less true?
If you never tell, never speak of it, will it become only a dream, less than a dream, a nightmare half-remembered?
Oh, if only the gods would be so good."

She's not referring to Robb at this point, but these are still her thoughts & moral values.
This goes to show that Cat is willing to fool herself about the secrets she wants to forget.
If she holds her secrets to herself, she can come to believe that the lies and the truths just become half remembered nightmares.

When she does reveal this secret she thinks to herself “now you’ve said it, now you’ve made it true.”

[Wikiceha]

So who informed Brandon that Lyanna was abducted?
Who instigated Robert's Rebellion?
Who wanted to hurt Brandon?
Littlefinger is the Machiavelli of the story,
seemingly harmless but holds a lot of power and a master manipulator.

Littlefinger was almost killed by Brandon, and discarded by Catelyn.
He couldn't win with force, so he told Brandon his sister was abducted, knowing he's a hot-head, which lead to Brandon getting himself killed.

From Catelyn:
"I had to beg Brandon to spare Petyr’s life.
... Afterward my father sent him away. I have not seen him since.” ...
“He wrote to me at Riverrun after Brandon was killed,
but I burned the letter unread.
By then I knew that Ned would marry me in his brother’s place.”

So she burned the letter, yet immediately after that,
she magically knew Ned would marry her?

One of the first things we see Catelyn do in the books is burn Lysa's letter.
She did it so instinctively you might think she had some experience.
It seems very unlikely for Catelyn Tully, in the midst of war,
to burn a letter before reading it.

And even before then we have Catelyn telling Ned of the letter from Kings Landing informing them of Jon Arryn’s death and she says “I saved it for you”

Implying she often does not. Sounds to me like we have a theme surrounding Catelyn and letters she keeps secret.

So How will we know?
Riverrun has a heart tree.
Bran, at some point, will have the access to all the information a reader will ever need.
GRRM did reveal there will more flashbacks into the past so hopefully it would shed some light on the subject.
Brandon, Catelyn and Littlefinger spent a lot of time running around Riverrun's godswood so that tree was not there for no reason.

Here's to hoping there will also be a reveal about the contents of Littlefinger’s letter,
If the burned letter wasn't important, it wouldn't have been mentioned in the first place.

It's still unclear why or how this influences the game.
But, it seems like it has something to do with the line of succession.
Robb thinks about it at length before he dies and Catelyn opposed him thoroughly.
Even Jeyne notes how much he thought about it.
Robb thinks Bran & Rickon are dead and doesn't want Sansa to succeed because she's married to a Lannister. So Robb thinks of Jon:

“Jon’s more a Stark than some lordlings from the Vale"
“A bastard cannot inherit.”
-“Not unless he’s legitimized by a royal decree ,”

-"If you make Jon legitimate, there is no way to turn him bastard again. Should he wed and breed, any sons you may have by Jeyne will never be safe.”

-"Should I die without issue, I want him to succeed me as King in the North. I had hoped you would support my choice.”
-“I cannot,” she said. “In all else, Robb. In everything. But not in this … this folly. Do not ask it.”

This is a quote from the end of the same chapter of Robb:
"I’ve thought long and hard about who might follow me.
I command you now as my true and loyal lords to fix your seals to this document as witnesses to my decision.”

So did he listen to Catelyn and choose another Heir?
Or did he name Jon his successor, the one thing Catelyn was afraid of all her life?
Even if he did,
if Robb's a bastard, that means he isn't a king and his wishes about who may hold Winterfell are void. That would also make Robb Robb Rivers, instead of Robb Stark. It would be an ironic twist of events if after all that's happened, after hot Catelyn treated Jon, in the end, Jon's not a bastard, but Robb is.

Bardp @ Westeros .org

[Begemotica]

Hvala, Wiki

[Wikiceha]

No frx
Zanimljiva je teorija u svakom slučaju

[Wikiceha]

Sansa kao nova kraljica 7k (ako ostane štogod od njih );
http://www.floor8.com/posts/3097-got...ne?a_aid=42860

Ima smisla.
LF-ova ostavština

[BrokenEmpire]

Sansa i Tyrion možda?

Otkrio sam ovu teoriju o Euronu relativno nedavno i sviđa mi se ideja unošenja nadnaravnog kaosa i na Jugu:

We have many mentions of a mysterious oily black stone: The Greyjoy Seastone Chair; the ancient mazelike foundations of the Hightower; the Toad Stone in the Isle of Toads; the cursed city, Yeen; Asshai-by-the-Shadow, the source of a lot of creepy things; and possibly the black meteorite worshipped by the Bloodstone Emperor of Yi Ti, and the Five Forts of the same realm.

Of these, the Seastone, the Hightower maze, Asshai and Yeen are explicitly said to be immemorial, of unknown origin, predating known human history.

In another echo of Lovecraftian horror, the people of the Isle of Toads are said to be fishlike in appearance, with webbed fingers. Also webbed are members of House Borell of Crackclaw Point, who call it "The Mark"; this may be related to folkloric sea creatures called "squishers".

The source of black stone items and fishy people has been theorized by mæsters to be an ancient race of half-humans, the Deep Ones – hybrids created by unknown sea monsters.

Storm's End seems to be strangely built for protection against the sea, where no humans could possibly attack; its walls are thicker seawards, and without windows in that direction. Melisandre says the walls are woven with protection spells.

Weird things are going on in Hightower and the Citadel, such as the glass candles. We've been introduced to a wizard-type character, Marwyn, who seems likely to appear more in TWOW. A Faceless Man, possibly went rogue, has infiltrated the Citadel with a skeleton key, seemingly after the well-guarded forbidden book, Blood and Fire or the Death of Dragons. The Hightowers Lord Leyton and Malora the Mad Maid have locked themselves in the Tower, researching spells intensely. "Might be", a captain tells Sam, "he'll raise an army from the deeps".

Euron Greyjoy, the voodoo viking pirate king, who is clearly involved with the occult and might be a Bloodraven ex-disciple, is interested in taking Oldtown, and is heading for it. So is Sam, who likely has the Horn of Joramund.

Moqorro has seen Euron in a vision, as "a tall and twisted thing with one black eye and ten long arms, sailing on a sea of blood." He's the greatest danger in his visions.

Devout Drowned God priest Aeron Damphair, thoroughly defeated by his childhood abuser, the blasphemer Euron, is desperate enough to try to do... something. He's a confirmed TWOW POV character. The Drowned God seems very likely to be related to whatever it is that created the Deep Ones hybrids.
Unbeknownst to all, Patchface has made successful prophecies, which means that his drowning made him a mad sea prophet – something like a Drowned God avatar? Melisandre has presaged that he's dangerous.

Melisandre's visions about towers and sea (why "towers" plural, though? Pyke?)

And Jaime's dream about the watery depths:

Seems like the Others won't be the only Westeros visitors in TWOW....

+ link na osvrt vezan uz određeno izašlo preview poglavlje TWOW-a:

http://poorquentyn.tumblr.com/post/1...tch-apocalypse

[Wikiceha]

BrokenEmpire kaže:

Sansa i Tyrion možda?
Otkrio sam ovu teoriju o Euronu relativno nedavno i sviđa mi se ideja unošenja nadnaravnog kaosa i na Jugu:
+ link na osvrt vezan uz određeno izašlo preview poglavlje TWOW-a:
http://poorquentyn.tumblr.com/post/1...tch-apocalypse

To bi bilo fora
Postoji veza između Krajooluje(koja će pasti u 6. knjizi, bar po objavljenim poglavljima) i Zida.
A čak se i Drugi klone vode

[BrokenEmpire]

Definitivno, ima ono izvješće iz Eastwatcha o "dead things in the water" ili tako nekva čudnija ekspresija. Bila bi zgodna neka Cthulhu apokalipsa, pa da cijeli Westeros na neki način doživi apokalipsu, a ne samo Sjever.

[Wikiceha]

BrokenEmpire kaže:

Definitivno, ima ono izvješće iz Eastwatcha o "dead things in the water" ili tako nekva čudnija ekspresija. Bila bi zgodna neka Cthulhu apokalipsa, pa da cijeli Westeros na neki način doživi apokalipsu, a ne samo Sjever.

Ragnarok bi bio fora
Priče o Drugima su zato jer postoji noćna straža (a ne "noćna mornarica" ), a i likovi koje znamo su povezani sa Sjeverom.
Loza na jugu je prekinuta u muškoj liniji, iako je (kao što smo vidjeli kod Stannisa) prožeta magijom (iako to može biti i posljedica samo pobočnosti Targaryena, a ne Barratheona)...

Teško mogu zamisliti Druge u Dornu, ali

[Begemotica]

BrokenEmpire kaže:

Sansa i Tyrion možda?

Otkrio sam ovu teoriju o Euronu relativno nedavno i sviđa mi se ideja unošenja nadnaravnog kaosa i na Jugu:



+ link na osvrt vezan uz određeno izašlo preview poglavlje TWOW-a:

http://poorquentyn.tumblr.com/post/1...tch-apocalypse

/|\≈{;„„;}≈/|\ Iä Iä! :klap:

[BrokenEmpire]

Čini mi se pomalo nerealnim čisto iz perspektive jer još ima samo dvije knjige, pa ne znam koliki bi bio kaos tako nešto uvesti, ali mogu se nadati

[Wikiceha]

BrokenEmpire kaže:

Čini mi se pomalo nerealnim čisto iz perspektive jer još ima samo dvije knjige, pa ne znam koliki bi bio kaos tako nešto uvesti, ali mogu se nadati

Ragnarok na djelu

[UrchinStar47]

https://warsandpoliticsoficeandfire....ouble-crosser/

Malo o politici na Sjeveru.

[Wikiceha]

UrchinStar47 kaže:

https://warsandpoliticsoficeandfire....ouble-crosser/

Malo o politici na Sjeveru.

Jako dobar članak
Sviđa mi se i stil, wheels inside a wheels inside...

[Michael Collins]

UrchinStar47 kaže:

https://warsandpoliticsoficeandfire....ouble-crosser/

Malo o politici na Sjeveru.

Hvala na linku