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Old 29.11.2013., 16:13   #241
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znanost2000 kaže: Pogledaj post
Provaj ti procitati ovaj link
"The Chinese did not attack our bombers - that must mean that we taught them a good lesson!"
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-03-271113.html


Kinezi su blefirali i popušili kad su im Ameri pročitali blef. Vjerojatno SAD ima špijune unutar najviših kineskih političkih krugova koji su znali da se radi o kineskom blefu i da neće oboriti avione te da će na taj način poniziti Kineze.
One bajke o tome kako Kinezi imaju 4000 godina iskustva u diplomaciji su pak smiješne. Razni "barbari" su pregazili tu Kinu mnogo puta kroz povijest.
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Old 29.11.2013., 16:25   #242
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...... Vjerojatno SAD ima špijune unutar najviših kineskih političkih krugova ........
NSA
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:16   #243
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ah..sta je dobro imat Amere za prijatelja..mozes radit sta hoces..Japan bez Amera? sitna riba..

Ovo su nebuloze. Japan je oduvijek bio napredniji i jači od Kine. Japanci su morali čak slati svoje obrazovne radnike (učitelje) u Kinu da podigne razinu pismenosti u toj zemlji. Kina bi bez ulaganja Amerike i Japana bila jedna prčija trećeg svijeta gdje bi jedan prosječni mali Kinez radio na poljima za šaku riže na dan.

Amerika i Japan su civilizirali Kinu. Ta cinjenica je jasna ko dan. A o raznim Burmama, Vietnamina i sličnim da ne govorim

Zadnje uređivanje master_mind_ : 29.11.2013. at 17:27.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:20   #244
svakako da nisu.
Japan i Amerika imaju specijalno prijateljstvo.
nista sta Japan radi(militarizacija i projekcija snage prema Kini)) u zadnjih cca 15 godina nije slucajno..on je proxy za Ameriku koja je tu radi Kine.
sto ne prekinu to prijateljstvo pa onda igraju ''igru''?
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:26   #245
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Ovo su nebuloze. Japan je oduvijek bio napredniji i jači od Kine. Japanci su morali čak slati svoje obrazovne radnike (učitelje) u Kinu da podigne razinu pismenosti u toj zemlji. Kina bi bez ulaganja Amerike i Japana bila jedna prčija trećeg svijeta gdje se radi za šaku riže.
Ovo volim kad kazes oduvijek. To bi valjda tribalo biti od Adama i Eve.
Ipak je Kina bila saveznik Americi i Rusiji za vrijeme drugog svj.rata a Japan je bio neprijatelj i na njega su bacene dvije pecurke.
Dan danas, japansko politicko rukovodstvo odaje svaku godinu pocast svojim ratnim zlocincima iz drugog svjetskog rata.
To je fascinirajuce kako su ljudi zasljepljeni japanskom soft power.
Zar je mogucno da prosijecni Hrvat gaji vecu simpatiju naspram Japanca nego naspram nekog Slavena kao sto je Rus?

Zadnje uređivanje znanost2000 : 29.11.2013. at 17:32.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:33   #246
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Dan danas, japansko politicko rukovodstvo odaje svaku godinu pocast svojim ratnim zlocincima iz drugog svjetskog rata.
i koga provociraju? i od koga imaju podrsku?

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To je fascinirajuce kako su ljudi zasljepljeni japanskom soft power.
i Kinezi koriste soft power.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:35   #247
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Zar je mogucno da prosijecni Hrvat gaji vecu simpatiju naspram Japanca nego naspram nekog Slavena kao sto je Rus?
pa ko kaze da Hrvati ne vole Ruse?
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:36   #248
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Ovo volim kad kazes oduvijek.
Ipak je Kina bila saveznik Americi za vrijeme drugog svj.rata a Japan je bio neprijatelj i na njega su bacene dvije pecurke.
Dan danas, japansko politicko rukovodstvo odaje svaku godinu pocast svojim ratnim zlocincima iz drugog svjetskog rata.
To je fascinirajuce kako su ljudi zasljepljeni japanskom soft power.
Kina je bila podijeljena zemlja za vrijeme Drugog svjetskog rata tako da ako je jedna frakcija pomagala Americi ne znači da predstavlja cijelu Kinu. Moras imati na umu da su mnogi Kinezi bili u japanskoj vojsci te su upravo oni činili okosnicu Japanske vojske u Mandziriji. Amerikanci bi bez problema pobijedili Japance da nije bilo Kineza (dapače pomogli bi i toj zemlji da postane gospodarska sila no Mao je svaku šansu za to uništio)

Ne odaje počast ratnim zlocincima vec palim ratnim junacima posto se Japan u većini slučajeva držao Ženevskih konvencija. Medju tim junacima bili su mnogo Kineza, Korejaca i Vietnamaca koji su podržavali da jedna azijska zemlja bude gospodarski motor te regije.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:42   #249
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pa ko kaze da Hrvati ne vole Ruse?
U prosijeku vise Hrvata zeli vidjeti ekonomski bogat Japan nego Rusiju, iako bi imali vise koristi od bogate Rusije. Sad tko ih je tako navrnuo, ne pitaj me.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:47   #250
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U prosijeku vise Hrvata zeli vidjeti ekonomski bogat Japan nego Rusiju, iako bi imali vise koristi od bogate Rusije. Sad tko ih je tako navrnuo, ne pitaj me.
Japan je bio saveznik Hrvatske nekoliko puta u povijesti, Rusija to nije nikada bila. Zbog pravoslavlja previše su okrenuti Srbiji te zbog togs ne vole Hrvate.
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Old 29.11.2013., 17:57   #251
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Japan je bio saveznik Hrvatske nekoliko puta u povijesti, Rusija to nije nikada bila. Zbog pravoslavlja previše su okrenuti Srbiji te zbog togs ne vole Hrvate.
znaci Hrvati ne vole Rusiju radi pravoslavlja ali vole Japan radi Budizma?
ja sam mislio da su ekonomske veze jace od religijskih..a i blize nam je pravoslavlje..
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Old 29.11.2013., 18:00   #252
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U prosijeku vise Hrvata zeli vidjeti ekonomski bogat Japan nego Rusiju, iako bi imali vise koristi od bogate Rusije. Sad tko ih je tako navrnuo, ne pitaj me.
ni necu..ja znam
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Old 29.11.2013., 18:00   #253
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znaci Hrvati ne vole Rusiju radi pravoslavlja ali vole Japan radi Budizma?
ja sam mislio da su ekonomske veze jace od religijskih..a i blize nam je pravoslavlje..
Voli on i volu oni pravoslavlje i cirilicu...ne bi inace pravoslavlje bilo u NATO i EU.
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Old 29.11.2013., 18:05   #254
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Japan je bio saveznik Hrvatske nekoliko puta u povijesti.....
Mozda kad je bio Poglavnik...ali cisto sumnjam da su znali jedan za drugoga.

Ma ne samo nekoliko puta, nego Hrvati su porijeklom iz Japana.
Prema japanskom vjerovanju Bog je najprije stvorio japanske otocje a iz japanskih su se stvorili hrvatski otoci...tako imamo zajednicke korijene.
Ima i objasnjenje zasto Japanci imaju oci ukoso a Hrvati nemaju.
Kinezi su na istoku pa uvijek skilju prema suncu a Hrvati su na zapadu...jednostavno ne triba ici u skolu...
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Old 29.11.2013., 18:10   #255
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Ma ne samo nekoliko puta, nego Hrvati su porijeklom iz Japana.
Prema japanskom vjerovanju Bog je najprije stvorio japanske otocje a iz japanskih su se stvorili hrvatski otoci...tako imamo zajednicke korijene.
Ima i objasnjenje zasto Japanci imaju oci ukoso a Hrvati nemaju.
Kinezi su na istoku pa uvijek skilju prema suncu a Hrvati su na zapadu...jednostavno ne triba ici u skolu...
imas dobre informacije
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Old 30.11.2013., 10:50   #256
Kinezi prvi put u povijesti poslali svoje vojne avione na japanske i američke

Kina je jučer poslala svoje ratno zrakoplovstvo na strane avione, što je prvi takav slučaj u povijesti. Kineski su avioni uzletjeli u novoj spornoj zoni zračne obrane koju je Kina proglasila iznad Istočnog kineskog mora. Poslani su u kontrolu zbog 12 američkih i japanskih aviona koji su letjeli kroz taj prostor.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...9AR0OM20131129
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Old 30.11.2013., 14:43   #257
Americka vlada naredila svim svojim avionskim kompanijama koje letu iznad spornog podrucja da raportiraju kineskim nadleznim organima za letenje.
Nesto nevjerovatno kako dogadjaji uzmu novi obrtaj.
US carriers urged to comply with China air zone rules
Ili sam ja ovo krivo razumio?
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Old 01.12.2013., 22:51   #258
Japan baffled by U.S. telling airlines to respect new Chinese air zone

"Japanci totalno zbunjeni - Amerikanci naredili japanskim airlinerima da poštuju kinesku zračnu zonu!"

Za one koji ne mogu otvoriti:

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U.S. State Department guidance to domestic airlines that they comply with China's new air defense zone in the East China Sea has perplexed Japan, which wonders if it still has the full support of its ally in challenging Beijing's claims to the airspace.

Japan and the United States had consistently taken a firm stand against China's designation late last month of an Air Defense Identification Zone (ADIZ) that overlaps the disputed Senkaku Islands in the East China Sea. The islets are administered by Japan but claimed by China.

But if the U.S. government places a priority on the safety of civilian aircraft in the airspace, it means that Tokyo and Washington will have trouble coordinating their responses.

While China praised the State Department's guidance, a senior Japanese Foreign Ministry official expressed concern.

“The U.S. action may represent Washington's intention to be interpreted either way, giving consideration to both commercial carriers demanding the safety of flights and the Japanese government,” the official said.

To Japan, the United States appeared to be a reliable ally that supported its firm stance on China’s unilateral action in establishing the zone, and was full of praise when Washington sent two U.S. B-52 bombers into the zone on Nov. 26.

However, the State Department on Nov. 29 announced a policy that U.S. commercial airlines should notify Chinese authorities in advance of their flight plans in the zone.

According to the online version of The New York Times, talks between U.S. government officials and airline executives began on Nov. 27. Two days later, the State Department settled on the guidelines for commercial carriers to follow established international air protocols, apparently for safety concerns for passengers flying through the disputed airspace.

"The U.S. government generally expects that U.S. carriers operating internationally will operate consistently with NOTAMs (Notices to Airmen) issued by foreign countries,” the U.S. State Department said in a statement on Nov. 29.

But it also added: “Our expectation of operations by U.S. carriers consistent with NOTAMs does not indicate U.S. government acceptance of China's requirements for operating in the newly declared ADIZ.”

The guidance to commercial airlines runs counter to the U.S. Defense Department’s approach with its military aircraft and

took the Japanese government by surprise. When a senior official with the Foreign Ministry learned of the news on Nov. 30, the official said, “Since there is no information available yet, we cannot respond.”

The ministry inquired the U.S. side about the guidance, and was told that there was no confirmation that the U.S. government had made such a request to commercial carriers.

Officials with the prime minister’s office and the Foreign Ministry stressed that Washington has never recognized Beijing’s newly declared air defense zone. The transport ministry reaffirmed that it will adhere to its policy of not asking commercial airlines to give China prior notification.

After Beijing declared the creation of the zone on Nov. 23, Japanese carriers notified Chinese aviation authorities with their flight plans to comply with their demand.

But the Japanese government called on the airlines to halt the notifications on the grounds it does not recognize the zone, which it said Beijing unilaterally established.

The Japanese government went further to make clear its position by flying aircraft from the Self-Defense Force and Japan Coast Guard through the airspace unannounced.

China hailed the State Department’s latest move as a gesture of paying respect to its newly created zone.

China Central Television reported on the guidance for American carriers on Nov. 30, quoting U.S. news outlets’ coverage.

“The Obama administration requested U.S. commercial airlines to comply with China’s rules when they enter the Chinese air defense zone,” CCTV said.

A flurry of messages hailing the development appeared on Weibo microblogging service, Chinese version of Twitter, right after the CCTV reports.

“(President) Obama saved China’s honor,” said one posting. “Finally, the international community acknowledged China’s air defense zone.”

The Chinese air force is set to defend its nation's claims to the zone. In the Nov. 30 edition, the Global Times, affiliated with People’s Daily, the mouthpiece of the Chinese Communist Party, carried “exclusive” reports on China scrambling fighter jets the day earlier to intercept aircraft.

It said that SDF aircraft took off from Misawa Air Base in Aomori Prefecture, and that EP-3 U.S. surveillance planes were the latest model in the line of the reconnaissance aircraft.

These reports were not included in a statement released by a Chinese air force spokesman on Nov. 29.

These reports, experts say, suggest that Beijing intends to show off its air defense and surveillance capabilities to audiences in and outside China by having local media report on intelligence that authorities gathers on SDF and U.S. military aircraft.

DISPUTE UNLIKELY TO INCREASE MILITARY TENSIONS

The Japanese and U.S. governments agree that given the current situation, military tensions are less likely to heighten around the Senkakus dispute.

An official close to the Japanese government cited a lack of protests by Tokyo and Washington over the Chinese reports of scrambling fighter jets in response to the intrusion of SDF and U.S. military aircraft in the ADIZ.

In autumn last year, Beijing announced that the Chinese military had conducted drills in the East China Sea at a site near the Senkakus, which China calls Diaoyu.

After an analysis of footage of the drills, the Japanese government concluded that video images taken during a separate drill at a different site were used in the announcement.

Subsequently, the Japanese government remains cautious about what Chinese authorities say on developments concerning the ADIZ.

Defense Minister Itsunori Onodera showed skepticism of the veracity of the reports on the Chinese fighter jets’ scramble.

An official close to the SDF said announcements about the scramble represents Beijing’s attempt to project an image of a strong China to the domestic and international audience.

“China cannot afford not to take any action when U.S. military jets fly into the zone,” the official said.

According to the Japanese government, there were no signs to point to the Chinese military spiraling out of control concerning the declaration of the air defense zone. Wording of the event employed in statements from the Chinese foreign ministry and ministry of national defense are coordinated after Beijing's announcement on the zone on Nov. 23.

Both Tokyo and Washington believe that there is little chance that China will back down and cancel the zone, given that Beijing called the establishment of it as national policy.

But when it comes to the air defense capabilities of China, there is no denying that they lag far behind those of the combined forces of Japan and the United States.

U.S. F-15 fighter aircraft are deployed at the U.S. Air Force’s Kadena Air Base in Okinawa Prefecture. In the event of a contingency, F-22 stealth fighters can arrive at the base in about half a day.

In addition, the U.S. Air Force’s comprehensive strength is massive, and its pilots are well trained. The Air Force can bolster its monitoring activities by flying early warning aircraft equipped with advanced radar systems.

“The Chinese military will be no match,” said a defense analyst.

On the Japanese side, F-15 fighters, the mainstay of the Air SDF, are undergoing upgrades to modernize them.

In contrast, the Chinese air force is believed to lack a sophisticated radar system and the ability to expand the range of its aircraft through air-to-air refueling.

In July, Chinese early warning aircraft reached the Pacific for the first time by way of flying over Japan’s southwestern Nansei Islands, which include the Senkakus.

Analysis by SDF officials, however, show that the Chinese military has yet to obtain the capability to dispatch fighter jets to the region.

In recent years, China has built up its armed forces. The nation’s first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, conducted its first drill on the high seas in November.

If the Chinese military achieves the capability to have the vessel freely navigate through the East China Sea, military tensions between Japan and China will significantly intensify, according to a senior SDF official.

(This article was compiled from reports written by Nanae Kurashige in Beijing and Yoshihiro Makino in Tokyo.)

THE ASAHI SHIMBUN
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Old 01.12.2013., 22:54   #259
USA blinked .... pomalo ovo je tek početak ... Kineska vojska se još uvik gradi ...
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Old 02.12.2013., 00:04   #260
Koliko iščitavam, Ameri su trepnuli, no Japanci i dalje idu po svome.
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